RETHINKING OF SHANE -SAD and PATHETIC

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 3:57 am**

First, let me say I have been a Pogues fan for many years. DC was my first show, but I have seen several live dvds, and knew what to expect.
I was front and center along the barrier Thursday night at the 9:30 Club.
I was tremendously excited about the show.

What then happened really surprised me. I felt tremendous sadness for Shane and complete disqust with the crowd. I felt the crowd was there to see the Shane sideshow, expecting Shane to be a mess and even encourage it.
During the encore of Fiesta, Shane downed the remaining 1/4 of the wine bottle, to the crowd's delight. Yes, Shane is a grown man and can make his own decisions, but he is also a performer knows what the crowd likes and expects. Aside from the fact of being an alcholic.

Right or wrong (and I'm sure most would disagree with me), its just my opinion. The Pogues band is superb all top notch musicians, but would the venue of sold out without Shane? Why did Waiting for Herb not do as well? Fans love Shane and his antics.

Shane needs help, and I've heard people have certinly tried. I heard many attendees say I just wanted to see Shane while hes still around.
Pretty damn sad if you ask me, the guy is a great lyricist, intelligent and a kind person. Would be a waste to drink yourself to death.

Did you laugh when Shane kept going to the wrong microphone, were you amused?

If it was someone we loved or was close to, would we of acted differently?

Sorry for the long winded, rambling post. I just wasn't expecting what I felt at the show. I know I'll take some flack for this post, but I know there were others that felt the same way.

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 4:05 am**

I don't think you SHOULD get any flak at all for your post, not that you probably WON'T get it from the fanatical-16yo-zealot-preacher-types, just noting that I said I don't think ye SHOULD.

Its is a very fine line to walk, chasing the love of an audience, and I have enough fun of my own making sure, at gigs, that I'm not looking at life ONLY through the bottom of my whiskey tumbler....fer someone like Shane, a creative legend in his own lifetime (who yes is STILL alive as we go to press), it must be fucking well nigh impossible to always do what is best for yer body.

In vino veritas - But also - All things in moderation. But I'd be the last person to give advice :wink:

I just think your post displayed an admirable concern for the wellbeing of a great performer who we should be able to see live out a not-unreasonably shortened productive fun lifespan. Know where yer coming from. I hope there's not too much of a shit-storm fer ye to weather.

Mise le meas,
Fintan

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 5:02 am**

I can't speak for others, but, though the whole band is terrific, I personally would have been far less likely to attend the show had Shane not been there. That is, however, (as if it really needs to be said), by no means saying I want him to drink more than he ought. I feel concern is a good thing, and so is acceptance and appreciation ~ a daunting balance at times I suppose.

I was at the same show, and the crowd where i was standing seemed to love the whole show. Special cheers were, granted, directed at Shane, but I didn't in any way perceive it as being "because he's a drunk," but rather "because we love Shane and want him to know we appreciate the hell out of his efforts to come to the US" .

I dunno, I wasn't up at the very front, but I thought he performed well, and sung well. Signifigantly my friend who's been seeing the Pogues since their early days was up front and said she was impressed how very well and happy he looked compared to when she last saw him perform in the US many years ago. (she's way anti-addiction too, and even she saw the glass of "how's Shane getting along" as half-full in this case)

I thought Shane was awesome, and I sure hope he takes care of himself too. Shane if you ever read this kind of stuff I hope it's at least as vaguely as entertaining and/or helpful as it is grating and meddlesome

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 5:25 am**

If not for your eloquent reply Fin,I think the shit storm would be felt by all.

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 5:48 am**

Why thank ye, orrok61, and may I say what a nice name ye have :wink:

d'ye get it from yer mother's or yer father's side.... :lol:

Nah, Scotty raised a really valid point. I've been a singer my whole life. Well, since the age of five anyway. I started singing semi-pro and playing around dives twenty-some years past, and playing Irish / Celtic music pretty exclusively for about 10-15 years. The bottle is sometimes hard to put down, let's just say that.

I would hate to see Shane just stagger down the Behan/Harris/O'Toole
"Let's piss our talents away"-stereotype-brick-road, but....

People who can write as eloquently (lucky cursed gifted jemmy sod) as MacGowan are often, shall we say, just a little bit sensitive to the ould ' ..slings and arrows of outrageous fortune...'

To be

THAT gifted....

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 5:50 am**

Yet another great post, Fintan.

Look, I don't pity much. People make their own lives, and am I not one to tell people how to enjoy themselves. If Shane wants to drink, then let a thousand flowers bloom. He's a nice guy, from nearly all accounts, and he sings for the Pogues. What's not to respect?

I respect his choice, and it's because of that respect that I see Shane with affection, not humor, and with admiration, not pity. And I respect the band members who choose not to drink as well.

Are the Pogues less of a band without Shane? Sure, like they would be less without Mr Chevron, Mr Woods, and the rest of 'em. It's just not the same without them all (no offense, Phil Coulter).

Anyway, I hope all who are checking out the East Coast dates have a hell of a time!

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:06 am**

Nice post yerself...

Yeah, I was thinking through the whole Hamlet metaphor, and thinking about how I've promised friends to not drink too much on St. Pat's (I'm planning on a 6-10 hour gig), and then thinking, yeah well phuque that I'll just have a wee nip of Jameson's 12 year old at about 1-ish to help me throat along, and...realisation came over me that phuque it. Life's too short..... more pricks than kicks... and I'd rather get my kicks now, not when I'm bloody dead. So, if Shane thinks anything like that, I could see how his behaviour could cause concern in some. For me, I just hope he stays clean. He drink as much nice rosé as he likes. Fuck, if he comes to Australia, I'll stand him a case of some REALLY nice plonk.... let's just say, I reckon Shane is like a reincarnation of Behan. And I wish I was the reincarnation of Flan O'Brien...

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:11 am**

Fintan wrote:

And I wish I was the reincarnation of Flann O'Brien...

You mean you aren't???

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:15 am**

philipchevron wrote:
Fintan wrote:

And I wish I was the reincarnation of Flann O'Brien...

You mean you aren't???

Only on Wednesday-Mondays inclusive. Tuesdays I goes down in the elevator to check the gauge same as everyone else. :wink:

The reading on the lever indicates snow near you some time I think.

I'd love to be able to write songs a fraction as beautiful as the gear you guys have gifted us with. One day. I may be starting late, but wahheyyy!

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:24 am**

I think all of us who love all the members of the Pogues including Shane would be annoyed at anyone treating Shane as a sideshow. I know those types, the ones who would go to see a performer "before they are not around anymore", picking out every little thing that shows their mortality. Of course we all want to catch Shane as many times as we can while he is still performing. The Grateful Dead had a "last show" back in the 70's- they ended up playing for almost 2 more decades past what people thought.

Obviously Shane likes his booze. I think he is actually taunting those people who are in awe of his ability to hold down booze- playing it up a bit more; sort of saying, "you want me to get drunk- ok, i'll show you drunk!" And then perform 2 hours with 2 encores. I don't know many other performers who can do it like that. Especially night after night.

But yes, I don't want to see Shane or anyone else cut short because of booze or drugs- and this is coming from a recovering heroin addict who was enslaved by the needle. I understand that need; that security blanket; and the sickness when its not around.

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:27 am**

Fintan wrote:Fuck, if he comes to Australia, I'll stand him a case of some REALLY nice plonk

I'll double it for California tour dates! I'll toss in some tea for the non-drinkers as well, if that helps. Come to think of it, perhaps a bottle or two of rose will appear at the Nokia for Shane and whomever else might like to partake. I do work in the wine business, after all, and I owe them that much for the Dublin gig.

You Aussies truly have some of the best wines around (especially Riesling and Shiraz) but I haven't seen too many Roses. Charlie Melton and Turkey Flat at least do good ones, though.

Slainte! Live your life!

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:33 am**

Nicely put Deitrich. Nicely put.

LittleCupcakes wrote:You Aussies truly have some of the best wines around (especially Riesling and Shiraz) but I haven't seen too many Roses. Charlie Melton and Turkey Flat at least do good ones, though.

Yeah, we make fine wines, and we grow truffles in Tasmania now that the French are starting to wet themselves over 'cause they 'fruit'(?) here DonUnder in Frances off-season. We even have/had a whiskey distillery down there called Sullivan's Cove from memory. Me, I'm a whiskey man/boy, and years of using my kidneys as a tertiary filtration system for colourants and contaminants in cheap-shite pish has left me able to handle pretty much nothing other than good Scottish single malts, Irish whiskey and the occasional Guinness or other beer. Got a nice bottle of Jamesons 12 put up fer St. Pats. Yummm..*shudder*

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 6:50 am**

Hey Fin,my given name has gone under a family tree search or 2 with a couple of different results...result A:dead end,meaning it was O'Rourke and changed for the obvious reasons...result2:a total mutt,Irish,Scottish,Norweigen,German.Other side was 2 fine County Cork families of Ferris & Slattery.I thank you for the appreciation of the given though!!Cheers to you mate!!

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 1:53 pm**

I don't think Shane would want any of our pity. Furthermore, I think it takes some balls and is very rude to call any grown man "sad & pathetic." As long as Shane is doing what he wants and surrounds himself with the proper people, we should not pity him. His lot in life doesn't seem to be that bad. I could imagine a whole lot worse from myself. It would take for Shane to come to America to have some puritanical twat looking down his/her nose at him & calling him pathetic.

On the other hand, the people at the show encouraging him to drink have a mentality not dissimilar to frat boys. It IS public knowledge that Shane has a problem with the drink. Those would be the improper people for Shane to surround himself with on a regular basis. They obviously would not look out for his well-being.

I would definitely have still gone to the show to see The Pogues sans Shane. I may not have traveled as far, but I definitely would have gone. That is, as long as they never hire some toolshed to take Shane's place. This is the Pogues...not INXS.

**Tue Mar 14, 2006 2:01 pm**

May I ask a question? Who is the shepherd to separate sheep from goats?Who was authorised to determine "proper" and "improper" people for Shane's surroundings?

RETHINKING OF SHANE -SAD and PATHETIC

RETHINKING OF SHANE -SAD and PATHETIC

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