Liverpool Feis

[Scottie Dog]

I wasn't able to get to Liverpool, living in the Nether regions and having to work that day meant no way fella!I have heard conflicting reports regarding Shane's appearance as well as the festival as a whole.My cousin hated the festival[he's a miserable Evertonian!]though he is a Pogues/Popes fan of long standing,he thought Shane was 'ok', looked ill and he felt for him,my cousins girlfriend LOVED the entire festival,thought Shane was great,but confesses to not been a fan!

Conflicting reports for sure. Whilst I enjoyed the festival as a whole, I'm not sure how anyone can say that Shane was at the races at all. He just about held it together in some parts, but in general his appearance and performance was pitiful. It pains me to see him this way. But it's what I saw.

[Scottie Dog]

Hi Heather, any chance of talking to your mate Celtic Dave about these for me PLEASE!!


UPDATED

http://pogueslive.blogspot.co.uk/

I'm after these if you'd be kind enough to consider helping me out PLEASE! I've managed to get some more so list edited

The Pogues

1985.10.15 - Unknown [**Not Got**]
1988.06.23 - Roseland Ballroom, New York [**Not Got**]
1993.12.17 - The Forum, London [**Not Got**]
1993.04.23 - Waiting For Herb Masters and Mixes [**Not Got**]
1993.05.18 - Waiting For Herb Demos [**Not Got**]
1994 - Pogue Mahone Demos (Both Sets)
2004.12.14 - Carling Academy [**Not Got**]
2005.12.14 - Carling Academy, Glasgow [**Not Got**]
2005.12.17 - MEN Arena [**Not Got**]
2005.12.23 - The Point, Dublin, Ireland [I have Lossy]

Shane MacGowan

1998.08.07 - Sziget Festival [**Not Got**]
2001.03.27 - LeeÕs Palace, Toronto [**Not Got**]
2001.03.31 - The Vic Theatre, Chicago [**Not Got**]
2003.03.17 - Shepherds Bush Empire [**Not Got**]
2003.09.26 - Fairfield Halls, Croydon, London [**Not Got**]
2003.12.20 - Olympia Theatre [**Not Got**]
2004.03.20 - Manchester Academy [**Not Got**]

Cheers

Gary

Fuck me! Change the record, FFS ! Or the bootleg even, whatever !!

[Toonboy]

I hope someone who is supposed to be a Pogues fan is not selling bootlegs for a quick profit.Naughty, naughty,i don't see the point and besides its illegal and this website should not be encouraging it.

[left]

Who’s selling bootlegs? This website doesn’t encourage it

Btw, where are the videos of Shane?

[in_the_morning]

I wasn't able to get to Liverpool, living in the Nether regions and having to work that day meant no way fella!I have heard conflicting reports regarding Shane's appearance as well as the festival as a whole.My cousin hated the festival[he's a miserable Evertonian!]though he is a Pogues/Popes fan of long standing,he thought Shane was 'ok', looked ill and he felt for him,my cousins girlfriend LOVED the entire festival,thought Shane was great,but confesses to not been a fan!

Conflicting reports for sure. Whilst I enjoyed the festival as a whole, I'm not sure how anyone can say that Shane was at the races at all. He just about held it together in some parts, but in general his appearance and performance was pitiful. It pains me to see him this way. But it's what I saw.

Wasn't there, but anyone who sees the live video with ‘Dirty Old Town‘ on yt and who isn't totally deaf or blind must notice that Shane was in seriously bad shape - no energy at all there, barely able to hit the higher notes, just plain mumbling into the mic. Don't get me wrong, he's a trooper and it's great to see him on stage again and not giving up, but the ‘performance‘ wasn't any really. This is coming from a die hard fan.

[Low D]

Don't mean to be a hater, but calling Shane "a trooper" is an insult to all the much older people I, and probably you, know who have recovered from much worse surgery. I know an old gal who had had both knees replaced and does (walking) marathons. Hip replacement did not stop my Grandmother from chopping firewood the two months of the year.

Shane is presumably back in that wheelchair because he can't/won't do rehab exercises or work with a physio therepist. His vocals are weak because he doesn't stay in shape, even less since ending up in the chair.

Look, I love Shane's art, and would love to see a return to performance and/or recording and/or writing (is he even? Little to no evidence). His lack of self care was part of that art, part of his process. We've seen this film before, it has two endings. Some get their act together and have a career rennaisance (see: Tom Waits), some drizzle away (see: Townes Van Zandt), squandering both their life and their artistic gifts. Keith Richards, maybe, has managed both. He's a trooper.

It's fine to feel warm and sentimental towards Shane. Just don't call can him a trooper.

[Mike from Boston]

Just to throw my two cents in, I was done with Shane as a solo act (or with the Popes) after a debacle of a concert in (I believe) 2001. It's funny because this topic went a bit off kilter with the bootleg sub-thread and one of the requests was from the Toronto show from the tour and that was even worse than the Boston show. He did get his act together for all the Pogues shows.

After seeing the 60th videos of Shane, I did post wondering in what configuration was Shane appearing at the Fest. IMO, if you attended the Fest expecting a decent set from Shane, you were certainly ripped off-and the blame is on Shane. I know alot of young people-many of my friends sons who are now in their 20s, who love to see him if he performed in North America-but in this state, they would be getting robbed. I was hoping the new teeth would help his singing and outlook, but it doesn't appear to the case.

[in_the_morning]

Don't mean to be a hater, but calling Shane "a trooper" is an insult to all the much older people I, and probably you, know who have recovered from much worse surgery. I know an old gal who had had both knees replaced and does (walking) marathons. Hip replacement did not stop my Grandmother from chopping firewood the two months of the year.

Shane is presumably back in that wheelchair because he can't/won't do rehab exercises or work with a physio therepist. His vocals are weak because he doesn't stay in shape, even less since ending up in the chair.

Look, I love Shane's art, and would love to see a return to performance and/or recording and/or writing (is he even? Little to no evidence). His lack of self care was part of that art, part of his process. We've seen this film before, it has two endings. Some get their act together and have a career rennaisance (see: Tom Waits), some drizzle away (see: Townes Van Zandt), squandering both their life and their artistic gifts. Keith Richards, maybe, has managed both. He's a trooper.

It's fine to feel warm and sentimental towards Shane. Just don't call can him a trooper.

Well you got a point there. I guess I was referring more or less to the fact that he's still here at 60, but thinking about it now you're right - that's not because of some particular effort or achievement on his side but rather due to a mighty portion of luck and strong genes / a generally strong constitution.

Funny that you mention Townes, who happens to be my favorite singer-songwriter. While he did deteriorate and slowly fade away due to mostly his alcohol addiction (he wrote and recorded his best work in the late 60s to mid/late 70s), he was still artistically and creatively relevant and quite active and productive in his later years. I mean sort of. He did write some really strong songs late in his life (such as ¹Marie‘ or ‘A Song For‘ - ironically the latter one being a sort of ode to Shane MacGowan, as Townes said so himself, he was actually a Pogues/Shane fan of some sort). But his voice slowly deteriorated through the 70s and 80s and was really shot by the late 80s/early 90s. Still one of the best creative artists I've come across so far imho.

@Mike: I was hoping for a sort of comeback as well with the new teeth and so forth, but I guess that won't happen anymore. Low D is right here.

[Low D]

Funny that you mention Townes, who happens to be my favorite singer-songwriter. While he did deteriorate and slowly fade away due to mostly his alcohol addiction (he wrote and recorded his best work in the late 60s to mid/late 70s), he was still artistically and creatively relevant and quite active and productive in his later years. I mean sort of. He did write some really strong songs late in his life (such as ¹Marie‘ or ‘A Song For‘ - ironically the latter one being a sort of ode to Shane MacGowan, as Townes said so himself, he was actually a Pogues/Shane fan of some sort). But his voice slowly deteriorated through the 70s and 80s and was really shot by the late 80s/early 90s. Still one of the best creative artists I've come across so far imho.

Yes, he's one of my favourites as well, and a great example of this same phenomenon. I agree that his final album, 1994's "No Deeper Blue", was pretty great. But he did 6 albums in his first 5 years, then another 3 in 22 years! And the stories i read about his final attempted sessions were awful. I was actually fortunate to see him during a period of relative sobriety in the early 90s, just after his tour with Cowboy Junkies. He was a charming performer, but his guitar playing and delivery were nothing like when he was young, when, to quote Steve Earle, he was the only person who scared Lightning Hopkins . He would have been in his late 40s, but looked and sounded 20 years older.

[left]

Just to throw my two cents in, I was done with Shane as a solo act (or with the Popes) after a debacle of a concert in (I believe) 2001. It's funny because this topic went a bit off kilter with the bootleg sub-thread and one of the requests was from the Toronto show from the tour and that was even worse than the Boston show. He did get his act together for all the Pogues shows.

Can we safely suppose that for the Pogues show he had someone/something who pushed and motivated him to get in performing shape while here he’s basically just being there and not much more?

[Toonboy]

I was fortunate to see Townes Van Zandt perform live a few years before he passed,and i have to admit he was dreadful.Live At The Old Quarter is probably my favourite Townes album and it was not right to see the same guy who performed that classic,reduced to a mere shadow of what he once was.I hope and i pray that Shane does not suffer the same fate,even if it meant not seeing him live again,i just hope he can make some kind of recovery.Luka Bloom's 'The One' need i say more?

[in_the_morning]

Funny that you mention Townes, who happens to be my favorite singer-songwriter. While he did deteriorate and slowly fade away due to mostly his alcohol addiction (he wrote and recorded his best work in the late 60s to mid/late 70s), he was still artistically and creatively relevant and quite active and productive in his later years. I mean sort of. He did write some really strong songs late in his life (such as ¹Marie‘ or ‘A Song For‘ - ironically the latter one being a sort of ode to Shane MacGowan, as Townes said so himself, he was actually a Pogues/Shane fan of some sort). But his voice slowly deteriorated through the 70s and 80s and was really shot by the late 80s/early 90s. Still one of the best creative artists I've come across so far imho.

Yes, he's one of my favourites as well, and a great example of this same phenomenon. I agree that his final album, 1994's "No Deeper Blue", was pretty great. But he did 6 albums in his first 5 years, then another 3 in 22 years! And the stories i read about his final attempted sessions were awful. I was actually fortunate to see him during a period of relative sobriety in the early 90s, just after his tour with Cowboy Junkies. He was a charming performer, but his guitar playing and delivery were nothing like when he was young, when, to quote Steve Earle, he was the only person who scared Lightning Hopkins . He would have been in his late 40s, but looked and sounded 20 years older.

No intention of hijacking this thread, but since Shane and Townes are sort of brothers in arms this is pretty relevant and interesting! Cool to hear that you had the chance to see him play live, I'm a bit too young for that (turned 27 this year) - but yeah you are absolutely right. I've seen a lot of Townes footage, and his once brilliant guitar picking and voice were pretty much ruined and gone by the 90s, even during that period of sobriety (which lasted about a year I've read). Yeah his ending was horrible - he actually recorded a version of ‘Dirty Old Town‘ which was part of his final recordings I believe, it's on yt as well ... just awful, the deterioration. I actually had a friend who mananged to drink himself to death a couple of months prior to his 33th birthday. He was at the endstage of the spectrum and eventually his organs packed in. Horrible what this drug does to many people, to say the least ...

I was fortunate to see Townes Van Zandt perform live a few years before he passed,and i have to admit he was dreadful.Live At The Old Quarter is probably my favourite Townes album and it was not right to see the same guy who performed that classic,reduced to a mere shadow of what he once was.I hope and i pray that Shane does not suffer the same fate,even if it meant not seeing him live again,i just hope he can make some kind of recovery.Luka Bloom's 'The One' need i say more?

The Old Quarter album is a classic and he was on great form there. The voice a bit rough but still had that magic spot, and his guitar playing is phenomenal. As regards Shane, I seriously doubt he'll make a real recovery. I find it quite unlikely that he'll just drop dead any time soon, but I don't think we will see any artistic and creative comeback. And the public perception is that of a once great and outstanding artist, who is now an old and jaded shadow of his former self in a wheelchair. At least if you read this interview with him from 1988, he sort of achieved what he said there: https://www.hotpress.com/music/one-of-t ... e-21673110 ... sort of really.

[Scottie Dog]

Just to throw my two cents in, I was done with Shane as a solo act (or with the Popes) after a debacle of a concert in (I believe) 2001. It's funny because this topic went a bit off kilter with the bootleg sub-thread and one of the requests was from the Toronto show from the tour and that was even worse than the Boston show. He did get his act together for all the Pogues shows.

After seeing the 60th videos of Shane, I did post wondering in what configuration was Shane appearing at the Fest. IMO, if you attended the Fest expecting a decent set from Shane, you were certainly ripped off-and the blame is on Shane. I know alot of young people-many of my friends sons who are now in their 20s, who love to see him if he performed in North America-but in this state, they would be getting robbed. I was hoping the new teeth would help his singing and outlook, but it doesn't appear to the case.

That’s exactly the point.
We all love the great man. But I kind of knew we wouldn’t be getting a proper set from him at this festival, even if the advertising suggested we would. Still I went, and I hoped. But I should have known better.
After the reunion in 2001 he was pretty consistent I thought, and sometimes simply fantastic. He sounded just fine with no teeth. There’s a lot of spin and pictures on the net that would suggest he’s currently getting back to being match fit when it comes to performing live. The reality is that he’s not.

[Low D]

As regards Shane, I seriously doubt he'll make a real recovery. I find it quite unlikely that he'll just drop dead any time soon, but I don't think we will see any artistic and creative comeback. And the public perception is that of a once great and outstanding artist, who is now an old and jaded shadow of his former self in a wheelchair. At least if you read this interview with him from 1988, he sort of achieved what he said there: https://www.hotpress.com/music/one-of-t ... e-21673110 ... sort of really.

It's true, he said his goal was to make enough money that he never had to work again, and he certainly achieved that goal some time back. But then why did he bother with "The Popes" and a couple solo albums? As much as anything, probably because he had a point to prove (to his old band mates) and it was great to see him reinvigorated. There were a few songs on those albums, like "St. John Of Gods", that i love as much as anything he ever wrote. I know somebody here talked about a terrible show in 2002, but actually the gig here in Vancouver in - i think - October of that year was probably the last time i saw a vital and powerful Shane on stage. "Poor Paddy..." was so filled with vitriol it could have been 1985 or something. The Shane I saw with the Pogues in 2007 was only OK, great on the ballads, not so great on the fast stuff. And I won't even MENTION the 2009 show in Portland, except to say that Spider tweeted that we all deserved a medal for our dedication to the cause.

Honestly, i wish he would actually just retire and stop with these occasional public appearances, because it's a sad and sorry sight. If his goal is a lazy hedonistic life, i might mention that he doesn't look like he's getting much enjoyment out of life, so what's the point? I wish he'd find that drive to prove something to somebody again.

Sigh.

[in_the_morning]

As regards Shane, I seriously doubt he'll make a real recovery. I find it quite unlikely that he'll just drop dead any time soon, but I don't think we will see any artistic and creative comeback. And the public perception is that of a once great and outstanding artist, who is now an old and jaded shadow of his former self in a wheelchair. At least if you read this interview with him from 1988, he sort of achieved what he said there: https://www.hotpress.com/music/one-of-t ... e-21673110 ... sort of really.

It's true, he said his goal was to make enough money that he never had to work again, and he certainly achieved that goal some time back. But then why did he bother with "The Popes" and a couple solo albums? As much as anything, probably because he had a point to prove (to his old band mates) and it was great to see him reinvigorated. There were a few songs on those albums, like "St. John Of Gods", that i love as much as anything he ever wrote. I know somebody here talked about a terrible show in 2002, but actually the gig here in Vancouver in - i think - October of that year was probably the last time i saw a vital and powerful Shane on stage. "Poor Paddy..." was so filled with vitriol it could have been 1985 or something. The Shane I saw with the Pogues in 2007 was only OK, great on the ballads, not so great on the fast stuff. And I won't even MENTION the 2009 show in Portland, except to say that Spider tweeted that we all deserved a medal for our dedication to the cause.

Honestly, i wish he would actually just retire and stop with these occasional public appearances, because it's a sad and sorry sight. If his goal is a lazy hedonistic life, i might mention that he doesn't look like he's getting much enjoyment out of life, so what's the point? I wish he'd find that drive to prove something to somebody again.

Sigh.

That was my quote actually, but to hell who cares anyway? yeah gotta agree once more. I think on Snake and Crock of Gold there are more than a few great songs, and all in all I love both albums with a few exceptions, but still great work I believe. As regards live, I saw him four times with the Pogues (Christmas 2009 in London, 2010 Münster Open Air, 2011 Bonn Open Air and 2012 Cologne Open Air) - especially the last show he was seriously obliterated, but there were other sound issues as well, the band wasn't allowed to play in their normal full db range, so the sound was a shitshow anyhow. The other three shows he was pretty good given the circumstances. I think the most vital and enthusiastic was the Münster 2010 show, maybe because it was the Pogues' first German gig since I dunno the 90s.

Yeah he honestly looks miserable on most photos or video appearances, but I guess he must be in a lot of pain physically and emotionally as well (that's what I meant with the trooper remark earlier on). But I don't think he feels he's got anything to prove to anyone anymore. Sad in a way ...