Shane's attitude concerning Peace and Love and Hell's Ditch

[pogues24]

Recently as of last Thursday night I started reading the Carol Clerk book about the Pogues and I was shocked to discover that Shane's viewpionts about the Pogue's last two albums while he was in the band, did a complete about face. I remember in a "Drink With Shane MacGowan," him claiming that only "half of Peace and Love was alright," while Hell's Ditch was a complete "dog" of an album. Now in the new book, Shane was qouted as saying that he always believed that Peace and Love would be recognized as the great album that it is some day, and evening claiming that he now believes that each of the albums that he made with the group are great; even Hell's Ditch, which was the album that MacGowan in past interviews had viciously denounced. Anyway, I believe now he realizes that their is material on each of these albums that is worthing noting. Mr. Chevron and fellow Medusans what is your opinion of the matter.

Iain

[DzM]

Shane has begun to play music with his friends again, and Barb has recently begun growing prize-winning rutabaga in her vegetable garden. Shane no longer tries to eat albums by The Beach Boys, and the police have not been called to his flat in several years. These should be the good years. And yet ...

"Honey? What's wrong?"

"I don't know, Barb. I'm still angry after all these years. I feel like I let my mates down, and they treated me badly."

"Oh, Shane. That was fifteen years ago! It's time to move on!"

"I know, Barb. But I can't. It hurts too much in my soul."

"Shane, you silly goose! You should eat more ketchup. It has natural mellowing agents that make life better."

"Gosh. You're right, Barb. I hadn't thought of that. ... Barb? ... Pass the ketchup!"

"I love you Shane!"

"And I love you Barb!"

These are the best years
The years of our lives
When insults and injuries of old fade
Like an empty ketchup bottle
And new memories flow
Like ketchup on a bun

This message brought to you by the Ketchup Advisory Board.


For those utterly confused by this, it's an ongoing joke from A Prarie Home Companion. Really quite funny. Really. ... Fine. Never mind.

[Christine]

Where all the men are good-looking, all the women are strong, and all the children above average?

Is that show is still going on? I used to listen every week... good memories.

[Plastic Paddy]

Where all the men are good-looking, all the women are strong, and all the children above average?

Is that show is still going on? I used to listen every week... good memories.

The older I get and the more used to the contributors I get, the more I'd like to think I understood you all.

Bob Hope.

I dont even like Ketchup (apart from on Corned Beef Hash)

[philipchevron]

Iain, Shane never promised anyone consistency.

[firehazard]

... Shane never promised anyone consistency.

Consistency is what you get from a good ketchup...

[MacRua]

Tempora mutantur, et nos mutamur in illis.
Look through your music collection or library. You'll for sure find something you'll be ashamed of as well as something well forgotten which you'll rediscover and enjoy it, maybe from absolutely new perspective. And it has nothing to do with consistency. Do not we change ketchup brands as well? Experiment with new, revert to old ones...

[Kilmichael]

I remember reading interviews from shortly after Peace and Love was released where Shane was saying that he thought it was a very under-rated album and one day would be considered to be a dark classic - if memory serves correct he compared it to 'Dark Side of the Moon' in that respect, although I could be wrong about that.

With Hell's Ditch I think his biggest complaint wasn't with the tracks they recorded at that time but with the final tracklist of the album - he felt that if tracks like Pinned Down, Aisling, Curse of Love etc. had been included instead of some of the ' real dogs' it would have been a much better album.

Or maybe it's just taken a few years for the quality of those albums to ketchup with Shane...

[philipchevron]

I remember reading interviews from shortly after Peace and Love was released where Shane was saying that he thought it was a very under-rated album and one day would be considered to be a dark classic - if memory serves correct he compared it to 'Dark Side of the Moon' in that respect, although I could be wrong about that.

With Hell's Ditch I think his biggest complaint wasn't with the tracks they recorded at that time but with the final tracklist of the album - he felt that if tracks like Pinned Down, Aisling, Curse of Love etc. had been included instead of some of the ' real dogs' it would have been a much better album.

Or maybe it's just taken a few years for the quality of those albums to ketchup with Shane...

The debate over the tracklisting of Hell's Ditch remains, to me, one of life's great mysteries. I was vocal in my support of both Curse Of Love and, in particular, Pinned Down, if not Aisling.

[Sober]

So who chose the tracks that would be on the album? Is it a "The Very Best of the Pogues" type of mystery?

[mats]

At least we got Curse Of Love as a b-side.

[philipchevron]

So who chose the tracks that would be on the album? Is it a "The Very Best of the Pogues" type of mystery?

Not even Carol Clerk's book quite clears this up. Maybe that's as it should be.

[Zuzana]

Another thing is which tracks would have gone if different songs had been picked up? Curse Of Love or Aisling are brilliant, but I wouln't be able to choose which songs (of those that made it to the final selection) should "fall victims" to them. Unless more tracks could have been simply added to the album, of course.

[Sober]

I don't like most of the songs that are not pened by Shane on Hell's Ditch. And this is not because Shane didn't write them, since I like all the songs not written by Shane on P&L (save for Blue Heaven). But this is a personal choice. So I guess that Rainbow Man and/or The Wake of the Medusa would have gone. But as I stated, that's only a personal choice, I guess that those songs are somebody's favorite.

[Cal]

Too right they are someone's favourite! Well, Wake of the Medusa is up there with the rest of the great Pogues songs for me. But that's what makes The Pogues so appealing, people see different things within their songs, which is why I can never accept any "best of" compilation. It is only one man/woman's best.