The Medusa Fora

This one have bothered me for years:

From "Boys from the County hell"

In all lyrics i´w seen on this song it´s like:
"And my brother earned his medals raping gooks in Vietnam" or
"And my brother earned his medals killing gooks in Vietnam"

But what he sings is, at least on all recordings i have off the song.
"And my brother earned his medals at May lay in Vietnam"

I could be that they think it´s to offencive but i mean that woulden´t be the first or the last time some not political right lyrics have been recorded.

does anybody know? Mr C?


Thanks in addvance.
Cheers

Johan

Johan From Sweden wrote:This one have bothered me for years:

From "Boys from the County hell"

In all lyrics i´w seen on this song it´s like:
"And my brother earned his medals raping gooks in Vietnam" or
"And my brother earned his medals killing gooks in Vietnam"

But what he sings is, at least on all recordings i have off the song.
"And my brother earned his medals at May lay in Vietnam"

I could be that they think it´s to offencive but i mean that woulden´t be the first or the last time some not political right lyrics have been recorded.

does anybody know? Mr C?


Thanks in addvance.
Cheers

Johan

When it was clear that "Boys" was going to be a single. Stiff Records requested the "Mi Lai in Vietnam" substitution as the raping/killing Gooks reference was never going to get on the radio. As far as I can recall, Shane has always sung the raping/killing Gooks version live and indeed, has been delivering it with added venom in recent times as it has collected contemporary resonance.

There is no PC aspect involved in using the casually racist language of the tormentor against him. For the same reason I have the line "Operation Asshole had the Ragheads on the run" in the 2004 version of the Radiators "Television Screen".

philipchevron wrote:
There is no PC aspect involved in using the casually racist language of the tormentor against him.

Really? I have always thought that racist language is a bad thing, regardless. And given that Shane isn't Vietnamese and you are not an Arab, I guess I would spin that around and say that it puts a racist slant (no pun intended) on a situation that is not inherently racist.

Eric V wrote:

philipchevron wrote:
There is no PC aspect involved in using the casually racist language of the tormentor against him.

Really? I have always thought that racist language is a bad thing, regardless. And given that Shane isn't Vietnamese and you are not an Arab, I guess I would spin that around and say that it puts a racist slant (no pun intended) on a situation that is not inherently racist.

My apologies. There is nothing inherently racist in an American foreign policy which explicitly values American life over Muslim or Vietnamese to the extent even that "we don't do body counts".

I saw a great t-shirt on a guy in the front row at Las Vegas the first night. In a brilliant turnaround of the shifting meaning of the word "Gay", his t-shirt read "HOMOPHOBIA IS GAY"

philipchevron wrote: There is nothing inherently racist in an American foreign policy which explicitly values American life over Muslim or Vietnamese to the extent even that "we don't do body counts".

To be fair, it isn't only American foreign policy that is inherently racist... they learnt a hell of a lot from the Empire on which the sun never sets...

Kilmichael wrote:

philipchevron wrote: There is nothing inherently racist in an American foreign policy which explicitly values American life over Muslim or Vietnamese to the extent even that "we don't do body counts".

To be fair, it isn't only American foreign policy that is inherently racist... they learnt a hell of a lot from the Empire on which the sun never sets...

Quite so, it could be argued that the very essence of the British empire was racism. But American foreign policy is common to both Nam and Iraq and Wilson kept the UK out of the Vietnam conflict, so the distinction was made for the sake of clarity in the case of the lyrics under discussion.

philipchevron wrote:I saw a great t-shirt on a guy in the front row at Las Vegas the first night. In a brilliant turnaround of the shifting meaning of the word "Gay", his t-shirt read "HOMOPHOBIA IS GAY"

hehe, thats a great shirt

"Me daddy was a blue shirt and my mother a madam
My brother earned his medals at Mai Lei in Vietnam "

His dad was a racist & mother a whore ..could you get any lower ?
US vet?

It is clear that Shane/any of his family are none of these .Is he playing that part .

philipchevron wrote:My apologies. There is nothing inherently racist in an American foreign policy which explicitly values American life over Muslim or Vietnamese to the extent even that "we don't do body counts".

Now hold on there Tex. Two wrongs don't make a right. I never said anything about a racist American policy. You took the opportunity to fling poo at America again, but I was only saying racism is bad, racist language is bad, and so we shouldn't use it. But.... in retrospect, the artist is given a pass card on most social bounds for various reasons that would probably make a good thread in and of itself. But back to your views of American foreign policy -- I don't think the policy is racist. I think it is implemented, and advocated, by people who have little interest in other cultures. And that's a problem. But then again, its the bad apples you hear about. I had a great friend who was so well plugged-in with Afghan government that as he was coming back the Afghans were requesting through official diplomatic channels that this guy be sent back because he "got it" and was helping the people and they loved his enthusiasm in their advancement. You'd never hear about that, but its all over Asia in spades. Some Americans, even those operating within the "American foreign policy," are not massacreing civilians, but helping them.

I agree with you RoddyRuddy on this. And if it was up to some people to decide we would never have heard about My Lan

philipchevron wrote:As far as I can recall, Shane has always sung the raping/killing Gooks version live and indeed, has been delivering it with added venom in recent times as it has collected contemporary resonance.

Although on the "Live from Brixton 2001" recording that accompanies the "Ultimate Collection" cd, he sings the "My Lai" version. Was this because the performance was to be officially released?

firehazard wrote:

philipchevron wrote:As far as I can recall, Shane has always sung the raping/killing Gooks version live and indeed, has been delivering it with added venom in recent times as it has collected contemporary resonance.

Although on the "Live from Brixton 2001" recording that accompanies the "Ultimate Collection" cd, he sings the "My Lai" version. Was this because the performance was to be officially released?

No, in 2001 he was actually regularly singing the Mi Lai version, I'm pretty sure. It may even be that he only reverted to the Gooks version when America's racist foreign policy became once again a matter of international concern in recent years.

Eric, it would be surprising if there were not heartwarming little anecdotes to accompany even the most horrific of situations. That's the nature of human beings. Somewhere inside every steaming pile of crap lies the possibility of finding a truffle.

I was just listening to a 1984 Peel Session and in this version Shane is singing "raping gooks" This was broadcasted in April 84 and before "Boys" was released as a single so I guess it was ok to sing this version. The F word however in the line " we broke his fucking balls" was not sung. Otherwise it was not censored.

What are the TV/Radio censor rules today in UK? When The Pogues did Boys From The County Hell on The Tube in 1985 Shane just mumbles all the curse words. Would the original version be allowed on TV/Radio today?

mats wrote:I was just listening to a 1984 Peel Session and in this version Shane is singing "raping gooks" This was broadcasted in April 84 and before "Boys" was released as a single so I guess it was ok to sing this version. The F word however in the line " we broke his fucking balls" was not sung. Otherwise it was not censored.

What are the TV/Radio censor rules today in UK? When The Pogues did Boys From The County Hell on The Tube in 1985 Shane just mumbles all the curse words. Would the original version be allowed on TV/Radio today?

As a general rule of thumb, assume that raping gooks may, in certain contexts, be permitted (especially if some of your colleagues are meanwhile "helping" gooks) but that singing about raping gooks will almost certainly never be. John Peel was a man who understood that protesting the thing was not the thing itself, which is why he will forever be irreplaceable in British radio. Shane's gobbledegook version on The Tube was his own protest at the absurdity of the ongoing censorship of the song. If they didn't want his original lyric, they weren't going to get ANY lyric.

And as for the hilariously bad re-written lyrics on the single version...

As far as singing 'raping gooks' or 'at Mi Lai', it seems to vary depending on Shane's mood. Up to recording 'Red Roses' it was definitly gooks, live versions since then have tended to vary - in the mid-80s it was Mi Lai, round about '89 it switched back to 'gooks', then back to 'Mi Lai', etc. etc. Both seem equally effective to me.