The Medusa Fora

philipchevron wrote:

The Duke of Ingmar wrote:

philipchevron wrote:

nboldock wrote:

Seven Towers wrote:1.IF I Should Fall From Grace
2.Rum, Sodomy And The Lash
3. Red Roses For Me
4. Hell's Ditch (not even close to the first three)

The rest I consider shite.

The live disc from Brixton is astounding.

"Shite"?! What a ridiculous statement.

You can see why we're not exactly all rushing into the studio to deliver an 8th album, can't you?

Well, for you there´s definitely more to lose than to gain.

That's not what I meant. I have nothing to lose either way. I would evaluate any new work on its merits, as any musician would. I do not carry around in my head a set of Red Roses-ometers, FallFromGrace-ometers, Rum-ometers etc. Unfortunately, there will always be fans who do. They don't want, or need, a new album and no new material could ever hope to compete.

Phil-What about Dylan? In the eighties he released such clunkers as Saved, Empire Burlesque, and Down In The Groove. However, he ended the decade with Oh Mercy, which was brilliant. Then, in the nineties, he gave us two classics-Time Out Of Mind and Love and Theft. So, it's not true that no new material can compete with the old. Why don't you guys hire Daniel Lanois? Maybe he could give you a jump start like he did for Bob.

By the way, I can not tolerate Dylan's new record. I think it's the most overhyped and overrated record in history. I'd rather listen to Peace And Love. Still, I have not given up on Dylan. I may love his next record. I may love The Pogues next record too. Maybe you could call it War And Hate, and put a six toed ballerina on the cover.

I hereby resign from this discussion. My points are not understood and nor, I suppose, is there any reason why they should be, belonging as they do to that secretive, arcane and complex thing called "Process".

I personally would love to hear a new album, just to hear what has happened to a band who hasn't recorded a new album in 12 years. I think it would definitely be different than any of the older albums because the guys have 'grown up' (or maybe not ) but if they don't record something new I would also appreciate that because there is still a lot to enjoy and I listen the albums A LOT and I think I'll never get bored with the old albums

philipchevron wrote:I hereby resign from this discussion. My points are not understood and nor, I suppose, is there any reason why they should be, belonging as they do to that secretive, arcane and complex thing called "Process".

I do understand your points, Phil. My point is affirming the fact that the lesser records lead to the greater records. They an important part of the process. It's not secretive, arcane and complex to me....At the end of the day, the music fan has a right to call it as they see it. There is nothing complex at all about that fact.

philipchevron wrote: I do not carry around in my head a set of Red Roses-ometers, FallFromGrace-ometers, Rum-ometers etc. .

I thought that was the funniest thing on this thread; then I read the thing about Radiohead and back to back great albums. Fantastic. Ricky Gervais eat your heart out.

soulfinger wrote:

philipchevron wrote: I do not carry around in my head a set of Red Roses-ometers, FallFromGrace-ometers, Rum-ometers etc. .

I thought that was the funniest thing on this thread; then I read the thing about Radiohead and back to back great albums. Fantastic. Ricky Gervais eat your heart out.

Don't laugh too hard Soulfinger. I heard (that though my posts), Phil has become a huge Radiohead fan. In fact, I have a good inside source that told me The Pogues are gonna cover How To Disappear Completetly with Phil on lead vocals in March. I can't wait to hear the diaspora sing, "I walk through walls. I float down The Liffey."

Seven Towers: Yeah, weaker pieces can occasionally lead to great pieces - especially when there are people who consider those "weaker pieces" to be great pieces

Pyro wrote:Seven Towers: Yeah, weaker pieces can occasionally lead to great pieces - especially when there are people who consider those "weaker pieces" to be great pieces

Yeah, P.T. Barnum was right.

Red Roses For Me is my favorite.

The FUN of playing music shows clearer here than on all the others. On RRFM, they channeled the spirit of traditional Irish music, and fused it with their own songs and their own energy in a way that made such a joyous sound.

My introduction to the Pogues was RRFM, back in 1989 from a friend who had the Enigma CD version (with the rose on the CD). That version had Whiskey You're the Devil as song #7, Muirshin Durkin as #15, and Repeal of the Licensing Laws as #16. I bought the regular CD version a couple years later (it had 13 songs instead of the 16 I was used to) and was not as happy, so when I bought the reissued RRFM this year with the bonus tracks, I was finally able to re-program the track order and re-create the original CD version I had grown to love.

JimSpark wrote:Red Roses For Me is my favorite.

The FUN of playing music shows clearer here than on all the others. On RRFM, they channeled the spirit of traditional Irish music, and fused it with their own songs and their own energy in a way that made such a joyous sound.

My introduction to the Pogues was RRFM, back in 1989 from a friend who had the Enigma CD version (with the rose on the CD). That version had Whiskey You're the Devil as song #7, Muirshin Durkin as #15, and Repeal of the Licensing Laws as #16. I bought the regular CD version a couple years later (it had 13 songs instead of the 16 I was used to) and was not as happy, so when I bought the reissued RRFM this year with the bonus tracks, I was finally able to re-program the track order and re-create the original CD version I had grown to love.

A happy ending indeed, though I'm sure you will be aware that "Muirshin" "Whiskey" and "Repeal" are not part of Red Roses as it was originally delivered to the record company and the first two are more accurately part of the Rum Sodomy era.

When the CD of Sgt Pepper came out, the first thing I did was put it into the sequence the Beatles would have used if they had not been obliged, thanks to the running times considerations of vinyl elpees, to divide it into two halves. It was rubbish.

philipchevron wrote:When the CD of Sgt Pepper came out, the first thing I did was put it into the sequence the Beatles would have used if they had not been obliged, thanks to the running times considerations of vinyl elpees, to divide it into two halves. It was rubbish.

Can you please share that sequence?

Not offhand. It's mentioned in the sleeve notes of the late 1980s (1987?)CD release of "Pepper" but I am not near my CDs right now.

philipchevron wrote:Not offhand. It's mentioned in the sleeve notes of the late 1980s (1987?)CD release of "Pepper" but I am not near my CDs right now.

According to the liner notes of EMI CDP 7 46442 2 (1987):

"The sequence of songs on Pepper is famous in itself, being -- on the vinyl version -- two continuous sides of music, without pauses between songs, or 'banding', to use recording parlance. But the line-up on side one, as first conceived, was different to how it finally evolved, and was as follows: 'Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band'; 'With a Little Help From My Friends'; 'Being for the Benefit of Mr. Kite!'; 'Fixing A Hole'; 'Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds'; 'Getting Better'; 'She's Leaving Home'.

"By suitably programming your compact disc hardware you'll be able to hear the album as it was originally intended."

This blurb is then credited as:

"Extracted from The Beatles at Abbey Road, to be published in late-1987."

Thanks

philipchevron wrote:

JimSpark wrote:Red Roses For Me is my favorite.

The FUN of playing music shows clearer here than on all the others. On RRFM, they channeled the spirit of traditional Irish music, and fused it with their own songs and their own energy in a way that made such a joyous sound.

My introduction to the Pogues was RRFM, back in 1989 from a friend who had the Enigma CD version (with the rose on the CD). That version had Whiskey You're the Devil as song #7, Muirshin Durkin as #15, and Repeal of the Licensing Laws as #16. I bought the regular CD version a couple years later (it had 13 songs instead of the 16 I was used to) and was not as happy, so when I bought the reissued RRFM this year with the bonus tracks, I was finally able to re-program the track order and re-create the original CD version I had grown to love.

A happy ending indeed, though I'm sure you will be aware that "Muirshin" "Whiskey" and "Repeal" are not part of Red Roses as it was originally delivered to the record company and the first two are more accurately part of the Rum Sodomy era.

When the CD of Sgt Pepper came out, the first thing I did was put it into the sequence the Beatles would have used if they had not been obliged, thanks to the running times considerations of vinyl elpees, to divide it into two halves. It was rubbish.

Thank you for the clarification concerning those three extra tracks -- I did not know that "Muirshin" and "Whiskey" were from the Rum Sodomy era. To me, they blend seamlessly alongside the original Red Roses tracks.

The point we both seem to be making is that, in our hearts, an album can be best defined as "what we're familiar with." Since, unlike most people, I grew up listening to and enjoying a bastardized 16-song Red Roses album, that version IS Red Roses to me, despite that not being the official version. Likewise, having Sgt Pepper's track order reprogrammed to something we're unfamiliar with is less-than-satisfying because we've grown up hearing and enjoying the original track order so much. In both cases, the version of each album that we FIRST hear and love defines what that album "is" in our hearts.