The Rare Oul' Stuff

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Expand view Topic review: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by MacRua Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:44 am

firehazard wrote:
in_the_morning wrote:Sorry but I don't know what ZTT is? :oops:


ZTT is the record label on which The Rare Oul' Stuff was released.


ZTT is the label on which all of Shane MacGowan & The Popes stuff was released, i.e. singles and two studio albums of 1994-1998 period (besides Across.. live album and live DVD).
That's where legs of The Rare Oul' Stuff compilation grow from.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by DzM Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:52 pm

No argument that it'd be nice if an artist was appreciated more for the merits of their original works than for covers, but there are some cases where it is certainly warranted.

Regardless of that, there's much evidence that Fairytale of new York is certainly the Pogues' most well known and most played track. Last.fm claims that over the last six months FToNY outplayed DOT by a factor of 4:

http://www.last.fm/music/The+Pogues/+ch ... ype=tracks

This is probably an unfair comparison though since Christmas was right in the middle of all that, and Christmas is really FToNY's season. Last week they were much closer:

http://www.last.fm/music/The+Pogues/+ch ... ype=tracks

As will all statistics, please remember that these are lies and damned lies.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by in_the_morning Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:43 pm

DzM wrote:
in_the_morning wrote:I actually hate it when people only know bands because of a cover version they did, but never mention their own great stuff.

Oh come now. Sometimes that's deserved. Tell me there's a single Joe Cocker original work worth even half of his cover of The Beatles' "With a Little Help From My Friends."


I actually don't know anything by Joe Cocker, sorry :D

No I just meant that there are people out there who like the Pogues because of "Dirty Old Town" but probably don't know anything about whatever "Lullaby of London", "Thousands are Sailing", "Fairytale of New York", "Sayonara", a.s.o...that's the sad thing because they do miss great music.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by DzM Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:31 pm

in_the_morning wrote:I actually hate it when people only know bands because of a cover version they did, but never mention their own great stuff.

Oh come now. Sometimes that's deserved. Tell me there's a single Joe Cocker original work worth even half of his cover of The Beatles' "With a Little Help From My Friends."

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by in_the_morning Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:09 pm

old barney greyheron wrote:Thank god it ain't just me! My wife says i'm too mithered by stuff like that, but it REALLY gets my goat..as they say...somewhere, i'm sure...was enjoying a book a couple of weeks ago...set in Leeds...real grim stuff it was..and the author was on about leeds united fc...them being beaten in the European Cup final 1976...now i'm no Leeds fan (MUFC me)..but I do know it were 75 not 76...I hate mistakes like that..it's just laziness...and I never read one more word of that book...petty? no...get yer facts right... :evil:


:D I like you!

In the german wikipedia article about the Pogues there are some brilliant mistakes. For example they say that the Pogues wrote "Dirty Old Town" and mention it as one of the Pogues' greatest hits. I actually hate it when people only know bands because of a cover version they did, but never mention their own great stuff. It is often declared that Shane MacGowan wrote "The Irish Rover" as well. And somewhere on the internet I read that "IISFFGWG" was released in 1987. :roll:

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by old barney greyheron Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:45 pm

Thank god it ain't just me! My wife says i'm too mithered by stuff like that, but it REALLY gets my goat..as they say...somewhere, i'm sure...was enjoying a book a couple of weeks ago...set in Leeds...real grim stuff it was..and the author was on about leeds united fc...them being beaten in the European Cup final 1976...now i'm no Leeds fan (MUFC me)..but I do know it were 75 not 76...I hate mistakes like that..it's just laziness...and I never read one more word of that book...petty? no...get yer facts right... :evil:

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by in_the_morning Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:29 pm

firehazard wrote:
in_the_morning wrote:Sorry but I don't know what ZTT is? :oops:


ZTT is the record label on which The Rare Oul' Stuff was released.

http://www.ztt.com/artists/shane_macgowan.html


ah yeah, thanks! Actually this is a bit annoying (from the link you've posted):

"When Shane MacGowan was fired from The Pogues in 1988 critics were quick to conclude this was the end of his career. His lifestyle (at the time said to include up to 50 tabs of acid a day) was making the headlines more than his music, but this soon changed..."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He was "sacked" (depends on the point of view I suppose) in 1991, not 1988. Why can't they write down 1991? It is so obvious that in 1988 he was still in the band and they had a major success with "If I Should Fall...". Why does a label get this wrong? The point is that people who don't know about the Pogues and Shane MacGowan read it and think "Ah he left the Pogues in 1988...". I mean everybody makes mistakes, no question, but I hate it when the media gets something wrong and everybody seems to believe facts that are not true.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by firehazard Wed Feb 25, 2009 2:33 pm

in_the_morning wrote:Sorry but I don't know what ZTT is? :oops:


ZTT is the record label on which The Rare Oul' Stuff was released.

http://www.ztt.com/artists/shane_macgowan.html

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by in_the_morning Wed Feb 25, 2009 2:18 pm

Dopey wrote:
Indio wrote:Okay, maybe I can soften my position and admit that there are some individual songs on Crock of Gold that aren't totally forgettable (I do like More Pricks Than Kicks). All I know is that I've owned that CD for years and never play it, while I still do enjoy the Snake and his work with the Pogues quite a bit.

My issue with Crock of Gold is that the vocals sound so tired and badly slurred, it's like Shane wasn't even trying on that album. And the Popes arrangements always sounded like they could benefit from some better mixing or production or something to give them a little more kick. It's not all bad, but it's definitely at the bottom of my list in terms of Shane's recorded output.


I remember speaking to one of The Popes at a Popes' gig around the time of their first EP coming out, and he said that the mixes used by ZTT for the album were rough mixes and not final, so blame ZTT if it sounds not as good as it could have.


Sorry but I don't know what ZTT is? :oops:

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by Dopey Tue Feb 24, 2009 12:13 am

Indio wrote:Okay, maybe I can soften my position and admit that there are some individual songs on Crock of Gold that aren't totally forgettable (I do like More Pricks Than Kicks). All I know is that I've owned that CD for years and never play it, while I still do enjoy the Snake and his work with the Pogues quite a bit.

My issue with Crock of Gold is that the vocals sound so tired and badly slurred, it's like Shane wasn't even trying on that album. And the Popes arrangements always sounded like they could benefit from some better mixing or production or something to give them a little more kick. It's not all bad, but it's definitely at the bottom of my list in terms of Shane's recorded output.


I remember speaking to one of The Popes at a Popes' gig around the time of their first EP coming out, and he said that the mixes used by ZTT for the album were rough mixes and not final, so blame ZTT if it sounds not as good as it could have.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by IrishRover Sat Feb 21, 2009 6:38 pm

Croick Of Goild ois exactly that, pure essentoial goild.. RNR Paddy, Loinesoime Hoigway, Paddy Publoic Enemy No.1, Moire Proicks Than Koicks, Back OIn The Coiunty Hell, Moither Mo Chroi !!!!! etc. BUT then agaoin, essence's noit meant foir everyoine, thats foir sure. Chroistmas Lullaby ois the best Chroistmas song of all toimes, aloing woith Faoirytale of coiurse.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by old barney greyheron Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:10 pm

Crock of Gold 'forgetable'....??? Shocked I am...love it to bits...better than The Snake by a country mile...still, music, like so many things, is all about opinions. :shock:

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by Smerker -unlogged Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:02 pm

Crock of Gold's a real grower.

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by in_the_morning Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:11 pm

My issue with Crock of Gold is that the vocals sound so tired and badly slurred, it's like Shane wasn't even trying on that album


Agree. And on "Across the Broad Atlantic" Live show (from 2001 I believe) he sounds so much more powerful and strong. There is "More Pricks than Kicks" played live, it does sound better than the album version.

On "St. John of Gods" Shane MacGowan's "tired" vocals, as you called them, do work well I think. As you get the image of this "crushed up man" saying: Fuck All...the voice suits on that one, as well as on "Long Lonesome Highway".

Re: The Rare Oul' Stuff

Post by Indio Wed Feb 18, 2009 3:33 pm

Okay, maybe I can soften my position and admit that there are some individual songs on Crock of Gold that aren't totally forgettable (I do like More Pricks Than Kicks). All I know is that I've owned that CD for years and never play it, while I still do enjoy the Snake and his work with the Pogues quite a bit.

My issue with Crock of Gold is that the vocals sound so tired and badly slurred, it's like Shane wasn't even trying on that album. And the Popes arrangements always sounded like they could benefit from some better mixing or production or something to give them a little more kick. It's not all bad, but it's definitely at the bottom of my list in terms of Shane's recorded output.

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